R15 Challenge, 31 October 08

[RichieG]

Hope you don't mind my taking this into a different thread...

OK moving back to Friday 31st Oct would those that expressed an interest rather do a R15 We could start at 1300 or later if need be and if you are working you might be able to get away with 1/2 days leave Also give us more time for pub/darts

Well, I for one am up for this! Just checking the 'rules' of an R15 - am I correct in thinking the 15 stations are chosen at random and it is the same as a 'regular' challenge? Am I also correct in thinking that the 15 are the same for each participant?

If so, here is the 'variation on a theme' idea I had, quite a while back actually. The different people - or teams - would have different stations to cover (for fairness, the stations should only cover zones 1 & 2 - maybe 3 as well, thoughts people?) with a final finishing station so thateverybody meets up at the same place at the end. (Perhaps the first station should also be a 'common' station as well.) This is more of a game rather than a challenge as such, as with each participant having to cover different ground as each other means that some will have to travel more than others. My original idea was to pick stations out of a hat, but do I understand correctly that somebody has a computer program that selects the R15? Perhaps, and I'm just thinking aloud here, each person/team has to pick, from the hypothetical hat, a certain number of Z1 stations, a lesser number of Z2, and (if included) one or two Z3 stations.

Though not necessarily for the 31 Oct, thoughts people?

(EDIT: I've changed the topic thread to take out the 'Variation on a Theme' note as this might not happen on this particular occasion, as well as embolden a bit of the original point to emphasise something I feel might have been overlooked!)

[Going Underground]

We did chew over the idea of Z3 stations before but decided there were plenty of variants within Z1 / Z2 to make this a totally different challenge each time. I think with Z3 included it may just include travelling up a stretch of line and back again, but I am open to all suggestions. Our current formula seems to work very well, i.e. starting station is drawn we meet there and watch starts just prior to opening the envelope which reveals the remaining 14 stations. Our regular R15 would hopefully e-mail (to a neutral person) a set of stations for us.....
I am happy to go ahead with this on 31st Oct., say 1pm or could back a little later if anyone so desires.......

[jbom1]

I really like the present R15 formula - common starting station, route planning while the clock is ticking, and the same 15 stations for everyone. I think the correct choice of one's finishing station is one of the key skills. A daytime start allows a meet-up afterwards; in the event of a later start or not being able to make the post-challenge session, I'm sure someone could provide a number to text one's finishing time to. Choosing from zones 1 & 2 seems to work fine, though Hakan did (I think) some modelling of other options involving different numbers of stations or zones.

[joy54]

I did like the suggestion of everyone having different stations to do, obviously some lists would be better but I think it would give a new dimension. Certainly would be interesting on the post challenge discussion! And with common starting and end stations it wouldn't be as unfair as some people might think.

[joy54]

I feel exactly as you do in your second point. Even if the end point wasn't fixed I think your probably right about all the times being within 1hr 17mins of each other its unlikely anyone is going to get an excellent set of stations (I'm sure Hakan can do the maths on that!) and even if you do its all about luck on connections as well!

[jbom1]

I believe that Hakan's modelling at http://www.tubeforum.co.uk/forum/viewto ... 60&#p14060 suggests a standard deviation of 23 minutes for sets of 15 stations from Z12, consisting of a fixed (Oxford Circus) start and 14 more stations drawn at random (the actual proposal here is a fixed start & finish, plus 13 randomly drawn from Z12). This is quite large compared with the typical margins between competitors in an R15 and suggests to me that the luck of the draw would play a major role in such a contest.

[greatkingrat]

I agree with John, with random stations most of the competitors would have little or no chance of winning before they even started.

[RichieG]

Well, I wouldn't class my version (which isn't intended to replace the current R15!) as a 'challenge' but more of a 'game'. I realise, and realised right from the start, that some competitors/participants would have a 'good' set of stations and a 'bad' set of stations - but that's part of the fun! Perhaps that's why it should be only ZZ 1 & 2, maybe even only Z1.

Anyway - are there people intrested in doing a normal R15 on 31 October?

[RichieG]

Hmmm... still three weeks to go, but at the moment it looks as if only myself and Going Underground are interested in doing this. (Sorry, I haven't been here long enough to know people's names from their screenames!).

Just to mention that my first post in this thread was used for two things - first, to split away from the thread that first suggested an R15 on this date, and second to suggest a slight alternate 'game' based on an R15, not to suggest that the alternate (SR15 perhaps?!) should be done (although it could!!!)

[Root]

Here's the perennial R15 question: How are you going to generate the list of stations and produce copies for each player or team without seeing it yourselves?

[Garion]

Allow someone who isnt taking part to do it?

[Going Underground]

Here's the perennial R15 question: How are you going to generate the list of stations and produce copies for each player or team without seeing it yourselves?

Would kindly ask Hakan to generate and e-mail to a work colleague who would print off and put in sealed envelopes announcing only the staring station... Ala Soup Dragon on the last 2 R15's

Still as Richie has said this is looking a tad low in numbers at the moment so not sure what will be happening.......

[Going Underground]

Evening Z1? Not ideal for pub after though...

I want to do a challenge during the day really as I am on leave that week..... something to kill the boredom of half term...

[jbom1]

If I understand correctly, Richie wants each envelope to contain a different selection of stations? (EDITED for clarity)

[Going Underground]

If I understand correctly, you also want each envelope to contain a different selection of stations?

No sir not I, the current format works very well and if it isn't broke.......